It’s been more then 20 years since the disintegration of the Soviet Union, which was preceded by ethnic conflicts and mutual charges. Baltic republics would say that they provided the whole country with sprats and received no money for it. Uzbeks insisted that they sold their cotton for nothing… and so on and so forth. So, let’s see how truthful those statements were.
Advertisement:
1. Estonia. GDP per head is 18274$.
2. Lithuania. GDP is 16997$.
3. Russia. GDP is 15807$.
4. Latvia. GDP is 14330$.
5. Belarus. GDP is 13864$.
6. Kazakhstan. GDP is 12401$.
7. Azerbaijan. GDP is 9953$.
8. Ukraine. GDP is 6655$.
9. Turkmenistan. GDP is 6597$.
10. Armenia. GDP is 5178$.
11. Georgia. GDP is 5057$.
12. Uzbekistan. GDP is 3022$.
13. Moldova. GDP is 2959$.
14. Kyrgyzstan. GDP is 2162$.
15. Tajikistan. GDP is 1907$.
So, as far as you can see, none of the republics has managed to improve quality of life greatly, after it got rid of the ‘oppressor’. Baltic countries, as members of the European Union, did not achieve overwhelming superiority over Russia. Moreover, many of the republics found themselves in a poor economis situation, and today their people have to go to Russia as guest workers. Statistical data (for 2010) is provided by IMF.
via ev-chuprunov
Apart from the GDP issue the pictures make those cities all look lovely. like in a travel post card. Very nice.
What?! Belarus has twice the GDP of Ukraine?!
Why is that surprising? Even during Soviet times Belarus was considered the most modernized republic. Also corruption is still a very big problem in Ukraine while Belarus has all but eliminated it.
It shouldn’t be a surprise. Ukraine was ravaged by years of democracy.
In Soviet times they were above Russia!
lol the Baltics were always living better then the rest of cccp. and would live even better if not for the 50 years of communist occupation…
Or not, since the infrastructure and education was built by Russia, the quality of population was imporoved, the whole region was industrialized, before it was just German semi-rural province. Russia poured money into Baltic republics, depriving Russians themselves to make Baltic republic happy (because they were always complaining for the smallest reasons). Now, when all this infrastructure is built, it’s easy to say “would live even better”. We don’t know that. History doesn’t recognize the words “would”, “could”, “should”. Perhaps, instead of trying to rewrite the history and make German nazi heroes, childishly complaining and accusing Russia in all the problems you need just admit this chapter of your history, be mature and grown up.
lithuanians lived better than the finnish people before WW2. Finland is a rich country now, oh maybe because they were not occupied for 50 years and did not have idiotic plan economy, dont you think?
Since before the 1940 when the Soviets came Latvians, Estonians and Lithuanians had built an economy and country as wealthy as Finland or Sweden, it is possible to look at those two countries today and say that that is where Baltics would be without the Molotov-Ribentrop.
Rofl. What infrastructure? The one that German war prisoners built after WWII, after the soviet “liberators” had destroyed existing one? Or the education system what was established by local Estonians and Germans during the 18 and 19 century?
Really? I mean really!? The Soviets bent over backwards to please the Baltics at Russians expense because they complained about the smallest things? One form of rewriting history is to whitewash Soviet motives in the Baltics with so-called good intentions toward the natives.
The Lithuanian SSR was actually on par with Finland and many countries in Western Europe in 1989.
It was the depression that followed the collapse of the USSR that destroyed it.
Where’s Poland? The largest country of the eastern block has been ignored.
The author weaves quite a web of sophistry with his fast and loose use of statistics. Is GDP “per head” an accurate measure of prosperity?
What was the GDP per head back in 1985?
(assuming accurate statistics exist, since these numbers were always “improved” after going through the mill in Moscow.
OR…have things actually become worse, or has the public reporting of economic conditions improved?
Remember, “the devil’s in the details” when it comes to statistics and a talented spin master can twist them any way he, or she, wants. I remember years ago an advertisement for Hyundai, where they claimed to out sell Buick. Sure Hyundai out sold Buick…from 4pm to 5pm on Sunday.
People, tend to see black or white, when the scenery is actually grey. There is no perfect model of capitalism and communism to compare. Today in USA there is no model of pure captialism, and in Russia, the same. Both systems are a mix of socialism and capitalism. The “fuss” is all about how much of our system will be dedicated to one, or the other.
You probably didn’t know that, but Poland has never been part of USSR.
And as it comes to the Baltics, the difference between 1985 and now is enormous in every aspect of life, thus the author must be wrong claiming that independence didn’t improve their lifes. And questioning the fact that USSR was an oppressor is pure ignorance.
Polad? Since when Polad has been part of SSSR??
Poland was never a part of the USSR; here we have only former soviet republics.
GPD doesn’t entirely reflect the quality of live. I live in Poland – country that has been “supervised” by CCCP and nobody miss that time.
100% true I Do not know what the “GDP per head” is in most western nations but I am sure that it is obviously higher than any of these but that does not mean that every person is “happier”.
GDP per head is another way to say GDP per captia which measures prosperity not happiness.To discover how happy people are with their nation one would need to poll them in the case of former soviet block nations you’d need to poll people who actually worked in both current and former soviet times to find out how they really feel.I strongly suspect that most would say that they felt happier today than they did in the old day.
Also the data came from IMF not that trust worthy in my opinion.
Bhutan is often named the worlds happiest country.
Without being part of the Soviet Union, the Baltic states could have had the equivalent GDP of Finland or Germany.
The word “could” cannot be applied. German GDP cannot be reached by any other country of EU even now. Highly unlikely it could have been achieved by Baltic states, taking in account Germany in the beginning of XX century already was leading in science and technology, was completely industrialized and Finland was a rising star, whereas Baltic states were mostly rural. No offence, but Soviet industrialization was the only Baltic leap in the economic history record.
The Baltic states could have had the GDP of Germany were it not for the USSR????
The Germany culture is light years above your Baltic “cultures”. You Blats will NEVER attain the level Germany attained, no one has yet. NO culture in world history has more accomplishments, regardless of all the evil they have committed.
I’m Polish and even I can admit that.
I agree — good photos! Too bad about the GDP, though.
Well, results are pretty the same as it was in soviet union.Baltic countries were the richiest part of ussr and middle asian countries were poor even then.
We can add that the Soviet GDP per capita in 1990 was 9130 USD and shrinking. The Estonians have doubled that in 20 years with no significant natural resources which is quite an achievement minding that Russia has not managed the same despite heavy export of oil and gas (furthermore Russia today does not equal USSR). Also in the Human Development Index only the Baltic republics have achieved the rank of “very high development”. Then it’s not a wonder that still today 90+ % of the people in these countries (including many ethnic Russians) rate the dissolution of the Soviet Union a good thing. In other parts the situations may vary, but the Baltics never wanted to be Soviet and never benefited of it – the Estonian SSR even reached the 1930s independent Estonian GDP level first in the 1970s.
Your GDP numbers are wrong, where did you get them from? The World Bank says GDP/capita of Russia is only $10,444 as of 2010, even Estonia is only $13,939. The wealthiest part of the former Eastern Block is Slovenia at $23,267, or if we include former East Germany, about $25,000.
http://www.google.co.uk/publicdata/explore?ds=d5bncppjof8f9_&met_y=ny_gdp_pcap_cd&idim=country:RUS&dl=en&hl=en&q=russia+gdp+per+capita
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_German_states_by_GDP_per_capita
i could also say that your GDP figures are wrong. Im guessing the figures in the article are from the IMF. Not exactly the most honest of people considering what their former head has gotten himself into. But the World Bank aren’t exactly better.
Damn, such low gdp for my country, Moldova. Mabe I should move somewhere. There is no future here is what I say. By the way, the building in Moldova’s picture is the Ministry of Agriculture if anyone interested.
Thanks, friend, that’s interesting. You live in the Chisinau?
Yes, I do.
Well, don’t be down. A lot of us want to be somewhere else.
Looks like things were better under the Soviet Union. Agree with Sean on the Baltics. Can’t deny the influx of Russian tech and labor surged the Baltic economies ahead.
Sean is just another brainwashed person.
What indisputable here is the fact that history cannot be changed. Perhaps it was bad, perhaps it was good. What should be remembered is the fact that even you wouldn’t be born if the course of history went another way. I mean the simplest fact of all – “would have been” is not what history and the reality operates with. You may want to dispute about how bad it was, how harshly they treated you, how violated your freedom was, it changes nothing. What consequence it has? People start to pity you, and despise a little, since complaining over history is pathetic. And USSR doesn’t exist any more. So, whom to blame? Russians? they are not communists anymore, many born after the UUSR dissolution. You still hate those young Russians? Illogical.
I live in Estonia and I’m happy like my parents and all my friends, more happy than we could even hope during Soviet time. And this is important. We have opportunities and freedom to choose. False opinions of people and lies won’t change the real situation. Even more, it shows the stupidity of those people. I can say that 99% of all Estonians don’t even consider of joining the Soviet Union again. It is only dark and sad history, which won’t hopefully happen again.
I agree with you and paradoxically – with Sean, too. What strange is that there are so many things altogether, inseparable from each other. USSR was a grim dark time, yet I believe that Estonia would suffer boring dull time and more than mediocre economy if it was left for its own, there is no way we can guess what would have happened to all the Baltic states. Poland, for example is a powerful culture with the strong education and scientific and technological brain power, but it can afford it, Baltic states, overall are small and it wouldn’t stand the competition with such strong opponents like Germany, France, Spain, Italy and Poland. Would they care about Baltic states if they would not be the victims of Soviet regime? No. Soviet industrialization was a good thing. Can you remember at least one Nobel prize laureate from Baltic? Can you remember anything worthy? Literature? Cinema? Wine? Theatre? Physicist?
But no offense. I think Baltic people are just fine and good fellas. I only wanna say you should stop blame everyone and should start to live happily ever after.
When will you russians understand that nobody invited you here and nobody wanted you here (well except a few red-coloured traitors). We could’ve managed without your infrastructure. Finland also was a rural state before WWII, and look where it is now. So summa summarum, USSR built us some roads, and yet that is not an excuse for 50 years lasting occupation!
lol, looks like Operation Red Flag Pro Russian Comments has commenced and Russian counter strike is underway!
Wanna bet on the outcome
lmao! Isn’t it obvious?
Ura!
After several days of faulty connections and network errors, after hours of banging on the keypboard in frustraion, after having to hack into ER’s cache system, fortress [too much vodka] has been conquered.
A moment of silence for those who fell defending [Sean].
And now. The glorious all-conquering RFENPR (Red Flag Everything Not Pro Russian) Brigade is now marching on towards the final bastion of Russophobia at [hau], where the final epic battle shall take place and we shall emerge the glorious victors.
Really low GDP compared to western countries. There’s no human development without economic grow, that’s the major issue. Other issue is the problem of the per capita. We all known lot’s of rich Russians and such that have billions of money. Those count to the GDP too but the major of the population will receive less then average per capita.
It’s the problem of 3 chickens for 3 persons, one person can have the 3 chickens and the other 2 with 0 chickens. the average is still 3.
low GDP is as problematic as the distribution of it.
I learned to love russia in ER. Really great country. I want to visit it for at least 1month. But then when I check my travel plans… omg so expensive, Moscow one of the most expensive cities in the world, yet the GDP is so low.
In my country we have many immigrants from ex USSR republics. They are most welcome, we don’t have problems with racism. We find that they are very well educated, some are professors, medics, architects and such. But they move here to work on agriculture, garbage collecting, fishing, house works, construction etc. It’s hard for us to understand.
It’s really a shame. I known some of them and I asked why did they moved in. They all say the same, there’s no hope in their home country. They receive less for being for example a doctor then for picking fruit in my country (compared to the cost of living of course).
Then I don’t understand why. Most countries have a good education and great natural resources. They tell me the problem is in corruption and in the distribution of the wealthness.
One thing I realised is that the social awareness of those countries is not much advanced. We see things like FEMEN and such and we think it’s absurd because we already had those kind of revolution like 50 years ago. It clearly shows that during URSS things were very closed and that democracy (in it’s full) has still a long way to go.
But things are getting much better. Most immigrants are now getting back and like we see here the GDP is increasing. Corruption has decreasing but still has a long way to go. FEMEN (despite agreeing or not) and such show that people still have word to say and that their opinion matters.
I known there are many anti-russian feelings in the western but that’s not the case of myself and of my country. I don’t understand those feelings. I try to see things from a neutral point of view.
That’s how things are see here.
If you really want to get in to Russia, don’t fly to Moscow, or anywhere for that matter. Just go to any of the neighbouring countries where things are cheaper and then drive to the border. Much cheaper and also lets you see the real Russia instead of the highrises and hustle-bustle of the big cities.
Best to do a crash-course in Russian though.
Gross Domestic Product measures economic activity, not quality of life. For example, when an oil tanker capsized off the coast of Alaska causing a massive fishkill, tonnes of people travelled there to clean up the mess, and Alaska’s GDP has never been higher.
But it decimated the fishing, and there’s no one in the state who’d think it was a good thing.
The article could be absolutely right – some of these countries look like they’re in decline. But GDP is only meant to measure levels of economic activity, not economic health or quality of life.